Moshe Ndiki discusses family dynamics with Pearl Thusi and Thando Mokoena on the 'Say Less' podcast

Families that come in all shapes and sizes, and, as such, the multi-talented Pearl Thusi and her daughter, Thando Mokoena, are stepping up to connect the generations with their new podcast, "Say Less".

The duo are on a mission to bridge the gap between the often-conflicting worlds of Gen Z and their predecessors, making family discussions fun and relatable.

This week was all about family dynamics.

They welcomed reality TV star Moshe Ndiki to share his inspiring parenthood journey as an openly gay man raising his adorable twin boys.

Meanwhile, Pearl is playing the role of a strong single mother, nurturing not just Thando but also her adopted younger daughter, Okuhle Thusi.

She opened up her heart about growing up in a home with two parents, who, like many, had their ups and downs.

"They both stepped outside the marriage at certain points,” she revealed, describing how that impacted her and her mother's life.

Then came Ndiki’s story. He was raised by a single mum, and although he had a dad, their relationship was complicated: "I was raised by a single mom, I knew my dad, his family, they all love me, but we never really had a close relationship ...

"I remember when I started my reality show, speaking about my journey with having kids, I went to him in the Eastern Cape to ask him, 'Dude, why were you never around?' I was scared because I didn't know what type of father I was going to be.

"I'm not saying that he hated me, but his absence made me feel like that. He just gave me a whole lot of excuses that didn't make sense. That was the part where I was like, 'Okay, I need to forgive you, for me.' ...

"That lack of relationship with my dad made me swear to the highest power that I will never make my kids feel the way my dad made me feel growing up, and that's how I am navigating my relationship with my boys, by showing up and just being the best dad they have in their lives.

"Social media comments are always saying, 'These kids need a mother, they need another parent'."

Speaking of parenting, Mokoena had her own ideas about her mom’s style. She thought of Thusi as an authoritarian.

Mokoena said, "You know I love you. You’re like my best friend, like my sister, that’s how close we are.”

However, she did share that there were times when her mom wasn’t around due to work. “There was a little bit of neglect, so I had to grow up a little bit…

"I had a support system, and that’s what I love, that you gave me."

Shifting gears to the lighter side of family chats, Mokoena pointed out that Gen Z is a bit scared about two big things: pregnancy and marriage! 

When the trio talked about tackling the "birds and the bees" talks, Ndiki shared his own humorous experience of figuring out his sexuality during school.

"I had girlfriends, I dated girls, I liked girls, but I had made out with a guy in primary school as well ... Then high school came, I was very feminine, I always had this personality.

"I would also deepen my voice when I was with my girlfriend. I slept with a girl, it was good, we did it over and over again. Then I broke my 'bum-ginity', slept with a guy, and then I was like, 'Okay girl, this is nice, but I want more nicer'.

"This was when I knew I was very much attracted to guys."

Later, Ndiki opened up more about his extensive surrogacy process, where he revealed that he had spent over R1 million.

"That was from the beginning of the process. There were a lot of things that needed to be done. The reason I went this way was because I had a certain type of image or vision of how I saw my family. I never saw myself co-parenting with someone.

"My egg-donor is a white lady. I literally chose her based on her health, life expectancy, and she said that in her picnic basket, she would have a charcuterie board and white wine.

"She also mentioned that she doesn't want to have any kids of her own in her life; she stays on a farm with her parents and siblings.

"She gave me 30 eggs, and I got 16 embryos. We transplanted two and both took, so that's how I ended up with twins, but they grew separately, and that's why they are not identical."

Watch the full podcast below.